why is it bye bye bmj ??
Nice to see that the scouting system is firing on all cylinders and the board aren't going behind BMJ's back. Just seen on the NewsNow feed, headline from the official site - 'Fancy Becoming A Coach?'
I was the guy who called for BMJ's head after the Everton game, and whilst I'm happy he hasn't gone, I still think the events of the last week would be excellent for spurs over the course of the season. The message has been received loud and clear: NO ONE AT SPURS CAN AFFORD TO REST ON THEIR LAURELS!!. BMJ has provided us with our best league finishes in 25 years but if Man City, West Ham, Villa, and Portsmouth carry on spending at the rate they are, within 18 months or less ninth might be a good season for Spurs.
We need to take advantage of our current best of the rest status, go for champions league, win a trophy, keep our squad and be able to attract better players (Bent!) Jol was saying things like, fifth was an over-achievement and would still be a good season, Fergie didn't win anything for his first four seasons, the top four have bigger capacity stadiums and more experience etc etc i.e. preparing us for failure or trying to take the pressure of the players.
Levy rightly, simply reminded him that Ramos has won 2 UEFA Cups, a Spanish Cup, qualified for the CL, challenged Barca and Real with 20% of their budget, all with Kanoute up front ... It is possible. This week was simply a kick up the backside for Jol, a wake up call to reiterate that the league is ferociously competitive, and our start was totally unacceptable. We are aspiring towards 4th as well as defending our 5th places.
I personally hope it makes Jol a more ruthless and urgent manager. If the Jenas, Zokora pairing need to be broken up, do it. If Paul's off form, give Cerny a run in the team. If you need creative midfielders on the bench, then drop a striker from the squad. Whatever it takes, lets be meritocratic, and try and win at all costs. That's the mentality it takes to be regular a CL club.
I'd rather have the events of last week now than in mid November when CL is no longer an option. All Premiership managers are under pressure, it goes with the territory. Now Martin, show us what you are made of.
For another view of the Jol situation click here.
Yes of course what you say makes sense – very well put as well. Its just very depressing because, as you say, we can’t turn the clock back and so we have a no win situation. In feeling-sorry-for-myself mode it is bad for some of us older fans who were beginning to have hopes of a genuine change in fortune (at last) – back to the glory days of 25+ years ago. But this sort of potential set back starts you wondering if we will ever see this happen (or even see us beat G**n*rs!) before we reach our dotage !
I don’t have any real words of wisdom as you have or answers – MJ is not without faults and the past two seasons have been extremely frustrating at times as well as euphoric. In fact, we could so easily have finished above fifth both times, ‘though whether we would have been ready for CL football is another thing. For all his faults, I don’t believe that another manager would necessarily do any better at present – we had a good team which is now even better (still need a left winger though). An important point also is to get things in perspective – even top four teams go through inexplicable difficult patches – MU have not had a good start this season and the goners have definitely fallen back in the last twelve months (and not just through loss of Henry)
So, how do we persuade the board that the should keep faith with MJ, and really try to regain everyone’s confidence in the club. Or is it now too late ? Only a year ago we were still losing good players to “bigger” teams and that is still a big risk and will ultimately undermine confidence of the players and therefore our progress.
A very good precedent for the way THFC should behave is the example of Sir Alex at MUFC. His been there years and fantastically successful but if memory serves me right this wasn’t the case to start with but the board of MU stayed with him and look what happened – and he is still there!!
I suppose the key thing is the Players – they are the ones – the only ones who can do this – show how much they respect MJ and do it for him and the fans/club every game.
Keep the Faith
Can anyone tell me how the callers are chosen for the phone-in shows on the radio and TV ?
Why is it that the callers all have extreme views almost diametrically opposed to the majority of the average Tottenham fan ?
What we need is to phone up the phone-ins and get a balance of views from Spurs supporters to show our support for Martin Jol. Get on the phones and let the world know that we are not all fickle and that we appreciate what Martin Jol has done for Tottenham Hotspur ... even if the board are not.
With the Dutchman, Spurs would not be in the position to make a move for Champions League football. A large number of people have said that if you have offered finishing fifth two seasons running, Spurs supporters would have bitten your hand off after some of the stuff we have had to put up with year after year.
The board have a point, in that we should not settle for fifth, but to take a realistic view, they should set that as a minimum and anything else on top of that would be a bonus. The top four clubs have had years of Champions League football and all the money that brings. They have become an elite within the Premier League and it is necessary to chip away at their position, which is what BMJ has begun.
With Tottenham on the edge of the breakthrough, it looks like his success might lead to his downfall.
Do what you can to stop his departure.
BENNY THE BALL
For another view of the Jol situation click here.
It has been another day of comment, statement and denial at the wonderful world of Tottenham Hotspur.
It should never surprise me that history counts for nothing if nothing is learned from it, but time and time again (Francis, Hoddle, Santini) the people at the club who make decisions fail to see what went wrong with the choices plumped for in the past and go blithely into a new era of error. For every forward step there is an equal and opposite doubling in Tottenham's case.
With the latest embarrassment surrounding the rumour, speculation and humilation about Martin Jol's position at the club, there are new depths to be plumbed. Leaks spring from within Tottenham's tight-lipped ranks being credited to no source in particular, but the press have to play catch-up, so quickly does the story move.
So the Sevilla coach met with someone who met with someone who offered him the Tottenham job and of course it must have been a Spurs representative who made the offer in the first place. So Spurs have to issue a denial on their website to ensure that they look like they are playing the game above board and so the whole farrago goes on.
Whether someone from Tottenham made an offer to Ramos or not, why is it reported that board member Paul Kemsley was in Spain in the same place as Ramos at more or less the same time. They might not have met. Kemsley and Ramos' agent might not have met, but like a coincidental game of Chinese Whispers, word might have got around and 2 and 2 might have been summed up in a single number answer.
It is not just the unsettling effect this is having on the manager, who has virtually been told that he has to deliver Champions League football for next season or he will be history (I am sure BMJ would learn a lot more from that than the Spurs board), but the effect that it will have on the team.
Knowing that the manager is living on borrowed time, should the rumours that "senior members" of the squad are unhappy about the way things are being run be true, they might decide that they will not play for the current manager to hasten his departure (not that such things ever happen of course). It would be an interesting scenario if this did happen, as the hopes of European football would be gone (UEFA Cup as well as CL). If Ramos did then come in and the players started to reproduce their true form, it will look like they couldn't be bothered for Jol, but would be heroes ... just for Juande. I have no reason to believe that the players would treat Jol that way and frankly, I wouldn't want to be them if they did. Many have said that they respect the manager and came to play for him and now those who are fit will have to do that.
Champions League football was a little out of reach before the start of the season, despite it being our best chance to finish in the top four for many a year. But injuries cannot be legislated for and the unwritten football law of luck evening itself out over the course of a season has never been written in stone for Tottenham Hotspur. We are still owed for that Mendes "goal" at Old Trafford.
What Jol will have to do is motivate the team to excel themselves to reach the heights unknown by any Spurs manager for twenty odd years. And even then, there was no indication that if he achieved Champions League football, that he would still be around to take Spurs into that competition.
It all seems a bit too comfortable at the moment. Jol is given this season to achieve what the board want. Ramos has one year to run on his contract. So he will be available in the summer of 2008. Spurs get Champions League football (or not). Ramos comes in for a brave new era for the club.
Cynical ? Moi ?? Been there before (not in the Champions League obviously). 1984 was a watershed in Tottenham's history. A European trophy. A manager leaves because of the board. Cynical ? No. Just realistic. And a little ashamed.
this straight from the start, I stated in my Everton reaction waffle
only a few days ago that we should NOT get rid of BMJ, under any
I would just like to add my
voice to the rest ... "Maybe Levy out !!" would have a better ring.
It seems to me that it is his direction and the boards mis-mangement
that have led us to this embarrassing point. How do you hold up
your head as a Spurs fan when this is going on I feel ashamed of the
actions of the board of directors ?
Someone somewhere must have it in for Martin Jol.
Two fifth place finishes with Tottenham put him among the most successful Tottenham bosses in terms of highest league placings, yet, the knives are out for him after just three games of the season.
Spurs have lacked stability over the last fifteen years. Too many managers have come and gone, spending too much money on players who they thought would give Tottenham the glimpse of success that the fans desired.
Along comes Jol, with a lot of money spent, but with enough points in the bag to qualify for Europe for two seasons running ... the only manager to do so since Bill Nicholson.
I'm not saying he is the new Bill Nick, but he has the knowledge of what a club like Tottenham requires from him in terms of tradition and a realisation that he will be judged by results. I am sure he would prefer to be judged on more results than just three into this season.
Some of the names being bandied around are just fanciful. Would Lippi really come to White Hart Lane ?? Elsewhere on this site, Capello has been mentioned and perhaps he might be interested, as he is unemployed, but in the past has hinted he would only be willing to take on Manchester United. When the Press trot out the name of Harry Redknapp, you know that something smells fishy. If the Tottenham board are seriously considering the current Portsmouth manager to take over at Spurs, then I have serious reservations about their knowledge of football.
Jol out because they don't believe he can deliver Champions League football. Just explain to me how Harry Redknapp is going to do it, when he hasn't in goodness knows how long in the game.
I think that someone on the board might have made a very ill-advised trip to Spain at a time when things were going badly, before waiting to see what happened. I defy any other manager to have done as well with the injury-hit squad Jol was left with. Oh, except George Graham, as the man who took Spurs to their last trophy would have shut up shop and got points at both Sunderland and against Everton, with dour, unexpansive football.
BMJ showed against Derby that he is willing to give youth it's head, by introducing Taarabt. With the defence decimated and now the attack decapitated, the side might have to take on a new look. It won't be the one that Jol imagined when he spent £40 million, but then money doesn't buy success and more than it buys luck.
With the Spurs board seemingly intent on bringing in a new man at the helm, it could be that Jol is not a bad general ... just an unlucky one (in more ways than one).
I just cannot believe it. Jol facing the axe. I just cannot believe it - I know I am repeating myself, but it really upsets me ... I mean I am really upset.
If Levy doesn't act to scotch this media stoked rumour now, it looks like being one of those self-fulfilling prophesies.
Jol is a good manager, and a decent man who is loyal to his team. He does not deserve to be talked about in this way. It was heartening to see the Spurs faithful coming to his aid on Saturday, even if the board palpably failed to follow suit. Any club that has aspirations to succeed at the highest level must have stability. It has been proven time after time after time after time - (yes, I am repeating myself again) .
Let's pretend the media are right ... maybe Jol and Levy don't get on; maybe Berbatov isn't a team player. But I will tell you this, I would rather have a good team and strong manager than one star player calling the shots (Look what happened to decent Bobby Robson at Newcastle).
What Spurs have lacked
over the years, at least since Sir Bill, was a strong manager.
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